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Thread: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

  1. #1

    Default Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    As the spring is almost here (calendar says so, not the weather forecast) and I am working my way trough the shopping list, some questions are popping up.
    First,
    how big is the anchor you guys are using? What is the least weight most holding that is working for you?
    Second,
    as I've put the order for the new sails, the jib will be non-overlapping. The boat does not have any hardware needed for this. Any advice (Jib sheeting by the mast, to the beam etc) for the hardware and design, pictures or whatever, much appreciated.
    Thanks.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    Quote Originally Posted by YoungGrumpy View Post
    As the spring is almost here (calendar says so, not the weather forecast) and I am working my way trough the shopping list, some questions are popping up.
    First,
    how big is the anchor you guys are using? What is the least weight most holding that is working for you?
    Second,
    as I've put the order for the new sails, the jib will be non-overlapping. The boat does not have any hardware needed for this. Any advice (Jib sheeting by the mast, to the beam etc) for the hardware and design, pictures or whatever, much appreciated.
    Thanks.
    If you are buying a new anchor consider an aluminium Spade. Very light for the holding power. Only problem I have had is sometimes it is not heavy enough to penetrate crusty coral sand.

    Good idea to fit hardware before ordering sail.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    It is mostly sand and mud around here (North East USA).
    I do not plan on long cruises, and prolonged stays in remote anchorages. (there arent that many places that are not overbuild) and this boat has limited payload/tankage (or non existed).
    I was considering something like Danforth/Fortress, easy storage is another reason.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    Quote Originally Posted by YoungGrumpy View Post
    It is mostly sand and mud around here (North East USA).
    I do not plan on long cruises, and prolonged stays in remote anchorages. (there arent that many places that are not overbuild) and this boat has limited payload/tankage (or non existed).
    I was considering something like Danforth/Fortress, easy storage is another reason.
    I have and use a Fortress as well, excellent for sand and mud but also a pain to stow, have to dismantle it. Fortress and Danforth anchors are horrible to handle, you will crush your fingers or poke a part of your body or the boat at some point. Much better to have single solid piece of metal.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    Hm, thats an excellent observation. I have a similar experience with my previous boat, but I've anchored so rarely, I forgot how much pain it was to manipulate the anchor.
    I see the spades are quite expensive. The Lewmar Claw on sale by Defender.com looks like a good enough version.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    Quote Originally Posted by YoungGrumpy View Post
    Hm, thats an excellent observation. I have a similar experience with my previous boat, but I've anchored so rarely, I forgot how much pain it was to manipulate the anchor.
    I see the spades are quite expensive. The Lewmar Claw on sale by Defender.com looks like a good enough version.
    There are a whole lot of single piece anchors and the Lewmar Claw looks OK. I had a 15lb Bruce with 15ft of chain and 100ft of rode on my old 24ft cat and it worked fine. The big advantage of the Spade is that it is available in aluminium and therefore very light, but expensive.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    IMO and experience it is the chain that makes or breaks an anchors performance, aside from the fact that some are clearly better than others on any given ground... horses for courses and all that. 1.5x boat length is the old rule but a cat being lighter is probably OK down to 1x boat length. The thing is that you will not really know for sure until you really need it, by then it is a little late. On the SW24 I run 1.5x boat length in 8mm and it has always held on first strike... but then I have not yet really, really needed it and with luck I never will have that that need Be conservative is my advice.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    the way I see it, chain is what helps the shank down, setting the anchor properly. Could there be a way to use an all rope line with some lead weight for the same purpose? The convenience and space being a premium, I am looking for some ways to eliminate the chain altogether.

  9. #9
    Join Date
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    Default Re: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    You may find it helpful to read the various articles about the lengths of chain and rope rode as well as the recommended anchor weights that have been published.

    There are lots of these articles but the manufacturers are a good place to start. Some of the others are academic treatise that can be rather hard work!

    A good straight forward one is http://www.rocna.com/kb/Rode_optimizations and there is more information on their site.
    I don't find the manson video so good but you may like it http://manson-marine.co.nz/SitePages/HowtoAnchor.htm.
    Sarca are less helpful, but check here http://www.anchorright.com.au/products/sarca-anchors

    There is also an incredible amount of good information hidden in even more utter rubbish on every forum!!!!!!! (This included)

    Whether you like rocnas or not, their article is a good start.

    IMHO of course.

    Mike
    Nothing works on an old boat, except the skipper.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
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    574

    Default Re: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    Quote Originally Posted by Zed View Post
    1.5x boat length is the old rule but a cat being lighter is probably OK down to 1x boat length. The thing is that you will not really know for sure until you really need it, by then it is a little late. On the SW24 I run 1.5x boat length in 8mm and it has always held on first strike... but then I have not yet really, really needed it and with luck I never will have that that need Be conservative is my advice.
    If we applied your logic, Zed, then when we anchor in 15 metres of water, we would only be paying out 13(ish) metres of chain. That would mean the chain was vertical in the water and the anchor simply dangling!

    I do hope I've misunderstood you!

    Karen


  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    574

    Default Re: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    Quote Originally Posted by YoungGrumpy View Post
    the way I see it, chain is what helps the shank down, setting the anchor properly. Could there be a way to use an all rope line with some lead weight for the same purpose? The convenience and space being a premium, I am looking for some ways to eliminate the chain altogether.
    I think the wisdom of having chain is to avoid having your boat separate from your anchor due to rope chafe on coral and rock. Unless you know precisely the sort of seabed you're dropping the hook on to, it's impossible to know for sure what's down there.

    Here in the Caribbean, for example, even in the sandiest or weediest of beds there are usually odd rocks too. Rocks that even if you didn't anchor over them, can ensnare your chain (or god forbid, rope) should there be a wind shift.

    Karen


  12. #12

    Default Re: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    Quote Originally Posted by Karen View Post
    I think the wisdom of having chain is to avoid having your boat separate from your anchor due to rope chafe on coral and rock. Unless you know precisely the sort of seabed you're dropping the hook on to, it's impossible to know for sure what's down there.

    Here in the Caribbean, for example, even in the sandiest or weediest of beds there are usually odd rocks too. Rocks that even if you didn't anchor over them, can ensnare your chain (or god forbid, rope) should there be a wind shift.

    Karen
    Would agree but it is not always possible to know and sometimes you have to anchor in deep water. If using chain/rode then you can bouy the rode just less than the depth from the end of the chain. So it keeps the rode from snagging on rocks or coral. If the wind picks up the bouy sinks and the chain lifts off the bottom.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    As I understand it, what Zed meant is the length of the chain plus the rope that you would need for the proper scope?
    I intend to use my boat mostly for daysailing/short cruising, and around here there is not that rocky. As a buddy of mine said, "you have a problem with the anchor, you turn around and go home".

  14. #14

    Default Re: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    Mike,
    thanks a lot for the links, as the weather around here suddenly turned warmer, all this info looks more practical.
    Hopefully, my club facilities will be repaired by the time the boat is ready!

  15. #15

    Default Re: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    Quote Originally Posted by Karen View Post
    If we applied your logic, Zed, then when we anchor in 15 metres of water, we would only be paying out 13(ish) metres of chain. That would mean the chain was vertical in the water and the anchor simply dangling!

    I do hope I've misunderstood you!

    Karen
    Yes.... just alot.

    That is the typical formula the old timers around here applied to work out the fixed length of chain in a chain/rode setup. It has nothing to do with the depth of water you are anchoring in. After the chain comes rode, around 3x water depth. You seem to be thinking about an all chain setup, typically a small cat will/should not carry all chain, it is far too much weight and would bring other penalties a long with it.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    Quote Originally Posted by YoungGrumpy View Post
    As I understand it, what Zed meant is the length of the chain plus the rope that you would need for the proper scope?
    I intend to use my boat mostly for daysailing/short cruising, and around here there is not that rocky. As a buddy of mine said, "you have a problem with the anchor, you turn around and go home".
    Put together as reasonably heavy setup for when you need it and a light "lunch pick" for day sailing use.... reality is that you will use the "lunch pick" 95% of the time when day sailing BUT one day you will be glad of the other setup, this normally occurs when some insanely improbable set of circumstances make "just going home" more than a little hard to do.... it happens, I have pulled enough recreational sailors out of sticky situations to vouch for that.

    For the other guys here.... it is a Seawind 24, we are not talking blue water cruising here, most of the time the pick will be down for hours not days and the weather will OK.... most of the time

  17. #17

    Default Re: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    OK,
    got the anchor/chain/line for the light use.
    Now, my problems are
    Any advice/pics about the non/overlapping jib sheets setup?
    Is it OK to have a set of fixed blocks both sides of the mast couple of inches wide or do I need a tracks for changing the angle?
    Another question. (I just talked to the mooring contractor at the club, they are ready for the boat). The way I did it on the mono, two mooring lines from both sides to the middle cleat. So far my front beam does not have any cleat, one or two, I have to get them and install them. Any comments?

    Thanks

  18. #18

    Default Re: Seawind 24 ground tackle and rigging

    What style of jib?

    Blade cut sheets at the mast beam @ around 8 degrees (check with the sail maker) You'd be well advised to have a short length of track running from say 12 to 8 degrees to allow some adjustment.

    The old jib sheets the same way that the genoa does, off a wire traveler over the rear deck (about level with the cabin end) to a track on the rear beam. The jib and genoa are both cut to sheet the same way.

    My cleats are set on the hull below the front beam and slightly forward. This keeps them out of the way, the mooring has a bridle. For anchoring I have a SS clip on the bottom of the forestay bolt so that I can run an anchor line via that to a cleat either side. I didn't want anything on the beam due to eventual corrosion issues and the snag factor.

    Originally the cleats where at the tip of the bow but it was a hassle to get out there and having the anchoring/mooring point further back over greater buoyancy eases the boats motion.

    2c FWIW.

    *** email Barracuda and check that sheet angle, my memory may be out! It may be 12 not 8... adjust accordingly :-)
    Last edited by Zed; 5th July 2013 at 12:46 AM.

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