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rickp
21st September 2009, 04:11 PM
From the latest Multihulls Magazine...


FASTCAT 605 GREEN MOTION: THE GREEN CAT...

It is now being built at Durban in South Africa, and you can be sure that the latest from the Africa cats range will get people talking. The builder is adver- tising an unladen displacement of just 13,000kg for this 60-foot boat, and even 11,500kg for the carbon version. An achievement which will not be the only one on this resolutely ecological cruising boat, as it will also be propelled by an elec- tric motor supplied by lithium-ion batteries, recharged by the solar panels, the wind generator, or the hydrogenerator. For the worriers, the builder will also provide a generator as an option... But with a 134m2 mainsail, and a 210m2 gennaker, for 13 tonnes, the motors will not be needed often!

We will keep you informed once we have been able to test this machine.

FastCat 605 Green Motion : length: 18.34 m - beam: 9.45 m - draft: 1.50 / 2.30 m mast height: 27.60 m - displacement 13 tonnes mainsail: 134.6 m2 - jib: 70 m2 - genoa: 98.5 m2 - gennaker : 210 m2 - motors:
2 x 18 kW - architect: Simonis Voogd.

IreAneY
21st September 2009, 07:47 PM
Boring :o:p, heard it all before and still the weights did not come near what was promised and as far as the Green Motion is concerned, I still do not think he has a running version or overcome all the gremlins - we shall see ;)

Talbot
21st September 2009, 08:50 PM
What do we call someone who orders a 60ft cat with an unproven engine system and from a company with apparently a poor reputation for service support
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other than rich bastard::)

ka8uet
21st September 2009, 08:56 PM
An optimist?

rickp
21st September 2009, 09:10 PM
An optimist?

Hah ;)

IreAneY
21st September 2009, 09:13 PM
Incredibly stupid or a
CF moderator/Gidders Lover ::)

Nordic
21st September 2009, 10:33 PM
How come I can only add two tags to this thread and 5 to others?


Please ensure that all African Cats/Fastcat/Gideon Goudsmidt threads are appropriately tagged. Go to the bottom of the page and click on edit tags, and add them there.

This will help any search engines looking at this site.

Alan

KGP
22nd September 2009, 04:35 AM
It is now being built...We will keep you informed once we have been able to test this machine. Any odds makers to provide the launch date over/under? Test it? Oh please do - preferably after the owner has lived with it a few months. We should be able to come up with many nice builder statements to put to the test. And please do weigh it. I'll take the over on that...

scotte
22nd September 2009, 05:59 AM
An achievement which will not be the only one on this resolutely ecological cruising boat, as it will also be propelled by an elec- tric motor supplied by lithium-ion batteries, recharged by the solar panels, the wind generator, or the hydrogenerator. For the worriers, the builder will also provide a generator as an option...Somebody tell me if my math is wrong. Since we are talking DC systems, I'm going to use KW and KVA equivalent as V*A=W, and ignore efficiency losses and Peukart's Law. The data below is taken from various threads, and I believe it represents the latest claims and published data.



3 hours of motoring time is claimed. The motors are supposed to use 10-25KW. Let's be the most generous, and use the 10000W figure, and let's assume we run at 75% power with two motors, so 15000W. So after three hours, that's 45000WH.
So let's say this is a model without a diesel generator.
Let's ignore wind and water generation for the moment, and just focus on solar - how many solar panels would it take to generate 45000WH?
One of the biggest available panels is the Kyocera 210 Watt panel. Let's again be generous and say we get the full output of the array for a full 7 hours (very much a generous figure). That's 1470WH per day per panel.
45000 / 1470 = 30.6.
So, in order to recharge 3 hours worth of usage in 24 hours, it would take 30.6 solar panels.
Now lets put up a couple of wind generators. The Air-X specs are for 100 watts in 15MPH winds. Let's again be generous and say we get 24 hours of wind averaging 15MPH. That's 2400WH per generator, 4800WH for both. That brings our 45000WH down to 42600WH left over.
Now lets throw in hydrogenerators. Things get a bit iffier here, but I found a thread about a Lagoon 420 hybrid where they saw 864W per shaft at 8knots. Let's figure on a 6knot average, which is 648WH per shaft for 24 hours with two shafts is 31104WH, again under perfect conditions. Hey this is really great, bringing our 45000WH down to 13896WH.
At 13896WH we now "only" need 9.5 of our solar panels to make up the surplus energy requirements to motor 3 hours in a 24 hour period under fairly ideal conditions being under constant motion of 6knots with a 15MPH apparant wind with a system that's perfectly efficient with no losses.

Again, I probably screwed up the math, and please feel free to correct my figures above, but assuming it's right, and all things are even, want to bet anyone would consider NOT getting a generator?

We're at 10 solar panels before we've considered anything but electricity for propulsion - we still need power for refrigeration, lights, nav gear, etc.

Sorry but the math just doesn't work out for me, and in the real world with system losses and non-ideal conditions we probably need to make up somewhere on the order of double this amount. Where are you going to mount 10 of these big panels on a 60' cat - much less 20 of them!

therapy
22nd September 2009, 04:09 PM
Where are you going to mount 10 of these big panels on a 60' cat - much less 20 of them!

Towed array.

KGP
24th February 2010, 06:35 AM
Every motha friggen chance he sees to inject his marketing bs, he takes. When are the cf IDIOTS going to enforce their own, blatantly clear rules, upon this lying, crooked, full of shit builder?

Talbot
24th February 2010, 07:39 AM
Every motha friggen chance he sees to inject his marketing bs, he takes. When are the cf IDIOTS going to enforce their own, blatantly clear rules, upon this lying, crooked, full of shit builder?

Stop sitting on the fence and tell us what you really think :eek:

You may possibly have a point :rolleyes:

Anyone who buys a boat and does not do their due diligence on problems with that boat/builder/design deserves what they get.

Anyone who does do due diligence should end up on here or on one of the blogs and realise the problems that have been discovered. Incompetence, poor building practices, blatant falsehoods etc need to be exposed regardless of who the builder knows.

KGP
24th February 2010, 07:41 AM
And again the marketing interjection, clearly against the cf rules, (rules for which others have been repeatedly slapped): "sailing is all about safety, first we have a bow that can be damaged with out worry..., we standard build 2 crash bulkheads..." "In the stern's we have a crash bulkhead 800 mm from the stern s... we have a closed flotation chamber ...
Besides that we have ... and we use Divinycell foam...
We use no more inboard engines so no hull penetrations there just outboard Green Motion electric drives."

We we we we we we, cried all the way home and into a proverbial hole, away from our owner (few owners, that is) warranty claims...

KGP
24th February 2010, 07:44 AM
Stop sitting on the fence and tell us what you really think :eek:


I feel damn sorry for whoever contracted this buffoon to build their dream ship. ;) But don't feel a bit bad about whatever negativity come about for Andy R and his band of CF nazi youth's.:p

scotte
24th February 2010, 04:28 PM
I reported the post, as it is in clear violation of the rules at CF:

Commercial vendors may not use any section of the forum except the Vendors Forum to discuss their products or services unless answering a direct question and even in this case vendors may not quote prices (unless in Vendors Forums).

Talbot
24th February 2010, 05:14 PM
I reported the post, as it is in clear violation of the rules at CF:


What - Gidders breaking the rules and it being ignored - surely not ::)

KGP
24th February 2010, 05:42 PM
I reported the post...

Did you ask them to remove his hundreds of similar posts? They don't give a rats ass about gidders breaking their rules! But don't dare post a link to this forum over there!

scotte
26th February 2010, 02:50 AM
Believe me, I know all that - but it won't stop me from trying. I've had at least a half-dozen posts removed for discussing FastCat, supposedly because other people reported my posts - so I figure I can play that game too, even though it's pointless... :mad:

ka8uet
27th February 2010, 12:56 AM
I think he runs that forum. I was reading some more of his comments about his boat yesterday. Alice in Wonderland has nothing on this guy! When he was asked for pictures he came back with some CAD diagrams. He says he's building this boat for himself. I sure hope so, so that no one else has to put up with what his two previous buyers have suffered!

paulrack
13th May 2010, 01:43 PM
How is the build of the Fastcat 605 coming along, do you have any updated pictures for us?

Aram Vos
3rd September 2010, 04:36 PM
I am sorry but for legal reasons the poster has requested that I delete this post.
ForumAdmin

jkd
20th November 2010, 04:07 PM
Hey guys, Where can I find a good Fastcat 605? PM me please. Thanks..


SPAMMER

ForumAdmin
20th November 2010, 04:10 PM
Spam deleted - thank you.

therapy
22nd November 2010, 06:19 PM
...............

rickp
24th November 2010, 04:29 PM
Seeing as this thread has been highlighted and given that I started it over a year ago with genuine interest about the 605 that was stated to be 'in build' by the magazine - lets see where we're at. This is what piqued my curiosity:

http://homepage.mac.com/rapayne/Fastcat605.png

http://homepage.mac.com/rapayne/Fastcat605-2.png

Should be nearly built now - so would love to see some photos! All I can find on the Africancats website is computer models which is somewhat disappointing...

rickp
24th November 2010, 05:00 PM
Would either of the 2 customers reported in the CF thread like to give us some feedback too?

KGP
1st September 2012, 02:59 AM
3 years after it was announced as being built, it's now on the water - and gidders in in full-contact marketing mode. :cool:

smj
21st April 2013, 12:40 PM
Looks like the Fastcats motors wouldn't power into a 15kt wind.
http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f48/greencat-605-first-pictures-84206-6.html#post1215691

Karen
21st April 2013, 02:38 PM
Looks like the Fastcats motors wouldn't power into a 15kt wind.
http://www.multihulls4us.com/forums/showthread.php?t=48/greencat-605-first-pictures-84206-6.html#post1215691

Think you've got your links muddled, smj ... the one above is all about Cheap Rand.

The one I think you're referring to is a post on CF. This appears on the GreenCat 605 First Pictures thread. The poster says:


Saw this cat wash up on the reef in Bonaire (http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/tags/bonaire.html) last week. Those motors just did not work, he could not motor (http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/tags/motor.html) against 15 knot (http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/tags/knot.html) winds and went assfirst into the island of Klein Bonaire (http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/tags/bonaire.html), just sayin'

He is then asked by another poster if he's sure he got the right boat.

I wonder if this is indeed true? Anyone able to shed further light?

Karen

Talbot
21st April 2013, 03:07 PM
Think you've got your links muddled, smj ........

Original link was correct, and had the CF post, but forum software removed the CF and changed it to M4US.

I know this procedure was initiated because CF childishly removed any M4US links, and thus Paul reciprocated.

Personally I am tired of this childishness, and would much prefer to retain the moral high ground.

Karen
21st April 2013, 03:11 PM
Well, a little detective work and it seems the Bonaire reefing accident did indeed occur for Goudsmit's 605 prototype, called 5th Child, launched last year. The CF member who reported it has a blog (http://www.gilana.org/), and he has made this entry under the photo of a tourist tripper boat:


Fake sailing ship, packed with people off the cruise liner. (this boat later was involved in pulling a catamaran (5th Child) off the reefs on Klein Bonaire. (I am not totally sure of the circumstances, but the cat has electric propulsion, and just could not make headway against the wind and was blown onto the reef)

Karen

Karen
21st April 2013, 03:14 PM
Original link was correct, and had the CF post, but forum software removed the CF and changed it to M4US.

I know this procedure was initiated because CF childishly removed any M4US links, and thus Paul reciprocated.

Personally I am tired of this childishness, and would much prefer to retain the moral high ground.

My apologies to smj, in that case. Thanks for advising, Talbot.

Karen